“Have you ever wondered why you never see speeches about paths to leadership for men?” asked Melina R. Kibbe, MD, FACS, FAHA, as she delivered the 2022 SIR Women in Interventional Radiology (WIR) Section InspIRed Lecture at Monday’s WIR Luncheon.
The luncheon also featured 2022 WIR Champion Award recipient Kari J. Nelson, MD, FSIR. Drs. Kibbe and Nelson both spoke on the challenges faced by women in IR.
In her presentation, “Paths to leadership for women in academic medicine,” Dr. Kibbe, a vascular surgeon and dean of the University of Virginia School of Medicine, outlined strategies to overcome real and perceived barriers.
According to data presented by Dr. Kibbe, when looking at radiology as a whole, women represent 30% of the faculty and 17% of department chairs. There are far fewer involved in medical journal editorial boards however—20% of all medical journal editors-in-chief are women, but in radiology, only 3% of journal EICs are women.
The disparity exists outside of medicine as well, Dr. Kibbe said, pointing to the fact that for every Fortune 500 company run by a woman, 13 were run by a man. This gap is more surprising when viewed in light of data that indicates women are actually more highly rated for leadership capabilities, Dr. Kibbe said.
“If there are enough qualified women to lead, and the competency of women rates higher than their male counterparts, then why don’t we have more women leaders?” Dr. Kibbe asked. The reason, she said, is because of a myriad of real and perceived barriers.
Due to implicit bias, women are not often thought of for leadership positions, she said, and are recommended more for what are considered to be nurturing and educational roles. In addition, these biases often lead to people labeling decisive female leaders as “difficult,” while a male counterpart with the same characteristics is considered to be “authoritarian.” Support levels are lower for women in leadership and expectations are higher, despite the fact that there is an immense wage gap between male and female physicians.
Women physicians also experience general disrespect, as well as sexual or gender-based harassment. Dr. Kibbe shared one statistic that showed that 86% of female employees have experienced sexual assault at least once in a job, and it’s 30–100% more prevalent for supervisors than employees. “So it just gets worse as you go up the ladder,” Dr. Kibbe said.
She shared a video produced by the American Association of Hip and Knee Surgeons, which featured male physicians reading out real comments their female colleagues had received in the workplace.
“Our contracts weren’t written with women in mind,” read one man. “What advice do I have for you? Birth control,” read another. Other comments were sexually hostile. The video echoed some of the experiences that Dr. Nelson spoke about earlier in the session, and Dr. Kibbe confirmed that she had experienced similar comments.
Beyond difficult and inappropriate messages, Dr. Kibbe pointed out that there are more limited career advancement opportunities, as women are not typically thought of for leadership positions and don’t have access to the same kinds of networks.
“The old boys’ network is alive and well,” said Dr. Kibbe. “One word: golf.”
But women also have their own role to play in overcoming barriers. According to Dr. Kibbe, women undervalue themselves, under-ask, and under-negotiate. “Many midcareer women opt to forgo leadership positions due to messy politics and sexist culture,” she said.
This speaks to the larger problem of inequity, one that is sometimes blamed on the “leaky pipeline,” which Dr. Kibbe says is a myth. “The leaky pipeline is never about choice but structural constraint and implicit gender bias,” she said. “The questions should not be why do women leave, but instead why might we stay?”
The solution, she says, is to respond to implicit bias directly and calmly, and to never give in to how others behave. “Always serve as the role model,” she said. “Others watch all your actions and listen to every word you say.”
Women must also advocate for themselves and take the opportunities that come their way—Dr. Kibbe encouraged the audience to become peer reviewers, serve on local committees, invite women to speak, lead and conduct research, and to apply for national positions of leadership.
“You can’t be what you can’t see,” she said.
